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Thread: The GOOD and the GREAT !!

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    SJS
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    The GOOD and the GREAT !!

    Here are the English and South African keepers standing up while a half volley is driven by the batsmen.

    Then there is the great Oldfield, who has moved across outside the offstump in line with the ball but is still low on the ground and has not risen since a keeper should rise with the ball as it comes off the pitch.

    A great picture of Hammond driving but for me a great action picture of a great keeper.

    I would like this thread to show, with pictures where possible...the difference between the good and the great
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    SJS
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    The only keeper amongst those I have seen who was perfect was Bob Taylor. I am sure I have a picture somewhere which shows him similarly positioned.

    Must find it

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    State Vice-Captain jot1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS
    Here are the English and South African keepers standing up while a half volley is driven by the batsmen.

    Then there is the great Oldfield, who has moved across outside the offstump in line with the ball but is still low on the ground and has not risen since a keeper should rise with the ball as it comes off the pitch.

    A great picture of Hammond driving but for me a great action picture of a great keeper.

    I would like this thread to show, with pictures where possible...the difference between the good and the great
    Shouldn't Oldfield be at least halfway up already, like the other two keepers, as the ball is already off the pitch?

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS
    The only keeper amongst those I have seen who was perfect was Bob Taylor. I am sure I have a picture somewhere which shows him similarly positioned.

    Must find it
    No player was or is or will ever be perfect. Even Taylor would tell you that.
    Sreesanth said, "Next ball he was beaten and I said, 'is this the King Charles Lara? Who is this impostor, moving around nervously? I should have kept my mouth shut for the next ball - mind you, it was a length ball - Lara just pulled it over the church beyond the boundary! He is a true legend."



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    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Jack Russel was brilliant standing up against medium fast.. With the ball skidding and moving around.. I have seen some almost superhuman stumpings off guys like Jon lewis and James Averis..

    I think he is the best keeper ever..
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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Jack Russell was the best I've seen.

    I remember him standing up to Gladstone Small (no medium trundler he) in Oz in the 1990/91 series. IIRC he stumped Dean Jones when he'd made a fifty & was looking well set. Can't find a pic tho! Arrgghh!

    I think Jack's reward was to be dropped for Alec Stewart's superior batting in the next test!
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    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby
    I think Jack's reward was to be dropped for Alec Stewart's superior batting in the next test!
    Quite right too.. Got to be able to hold a bat!

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langeveldt
    Quite right too.. Got to be able to hold a bat!
    The irony was that Jack could; he was one of the ugliest looking batsmen you ever saw, but averaged over 27 in tests. Which compares quite well with our current incumbent (a shade over 31, IIRC), especially when you take account of byes & dropped chances.

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    SJS
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    Quote Originally Posted by jot1
    Shouldn't Oldfield be at least halfway up already, like the other two keepers, as the ball is already off the pitch?
    NO.

    He shouldnt be.

    You dont get up till the ball starts rising. If it doesnt rise, you dont rise.

    of course, it is possible that the batsman has played the ball on the rise (though it doesnt look so in Gibbs case at least) in this case, the keeper will have started to tise and what you say could be partly true.

    But I have been closely watching the keepers in slow motion, almost everyone today gets up a bit earlier and as a matter of habit and when they get up seems more dictated by the batsman's stroke play and movements than where and when the ball pitches.

    Actually, a long hop will hit the deck much earlier and the keeper will rise much earlier too. But for a yorker, he is in the best position to collect (in case it misses both bat and stumps) if he hasnt risen (almost).

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    From most recent times, Healy came very close. He was a much better keeper than he is given credit for. In an all time list, surely.

    The better keepers used to come from England , mostly, due to the stronger insistence on technique by English coaches . Keeping is not much helped by innovation . A good technique is basic to good keeping besides the individual skills and gifts of nature in reflexes etc. But today, the coaching element seems to have be on the decline in England and this can be seen in all aspects of the game.

    In bowling it stands out with the decline of the movement in the air which, besides other things, relies so much on the correctness of action and in keeping.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby
    Jack Russell was the best I've seen.

    I remember him standing up to Gladstone Small (no medium trundler he) in Oz in the 1990/91 series. IIRC he stumped Dean Jones when he'd made a fifty & was looking well set. Can't find a pic tho! Arrgghh!
    Thats a great example.

    Many people are stunned when keepers are able to stand up to medium pace or above.

    The only way you can do it without putting yourself to grave risk is by risnig with the ball and having your gloves right behind the ball. Thats the only way you give yourself a chance of the ball hitting the midle of the gloves if the batsman msses it or if there is a fine edge and very little deviation. There is no time for anything else.

    A keeper who moves too much is in trouble in such a case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mxyzptlk
    No player was or is or will ever be perfect. Even Taylor would tell you that.
    Agreed. But its not for perfection. Its to give yourself the best chance to get the ball in your gloves.

    You must have seen those fractional seconds they show when they capyture the "reacttion time" for some slip cathes nowadays. Can you imagine what is the reaction time for a keeper when the ball has 5 -6 feet to travel at best ? Next to nothing. Rising with the ball, and having your gloves behind the ball at all times, so that it hits the middle of the gloves if the ball is not touched, gives the keeper the best chance of being nearest to the ball if there is a small deviation from an edge.

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    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS
    A great picture of Hammond driving but for me a great action picture of a great keeper.
    If the batsman misses it, it looks like a potential no ball to me.
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    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langeveldt
    Quite right too.. Got to be able to hold a bat!
    The thing is, while the 2 were in direct competition, Stewart's average when keeping was less than Russell's

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    State Vice-Captain jot1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS
    NO.

    He shouldnt be.

    You dont get up till the ball starts rising. If it doesnt rise, you dont rise.

    of course, it is possible that the batsman has played the ball on the rise (though it doesnt look so in Gibbs case at least) in this case, the keeper will have started to tise and what you say could be partly true.

    But I have been closely watching the keepers in slow motion, almost everyone today gets up a bit earlier and as a matter of habit and when they get up seems more dictated by the batsman's stroke play and movements than where and when the ball pitches.

    Actually, a long hop will hit the deck much earlier and the keeper will rise much earlier too. But for a yorker, he is in the best position to collect (in case it misses both bat and stumps) if he hasnt risen (almost).
    Thank you. I have never seen any of the oldies play, so I presumed the way the guys do it today is the correct way!

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