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**Official** New Zealand in Australia Thread

anzac

International Debutant
what's the talk back Home re the likely lineup - Sinclair to Open & a 5-5 split with Mills & Butler as starters?????????

any calls for Flem or McCullum to Open etc........???????
 

Craig

World Traveller
It's pointless to open up with McCullum as well as keeping, I just don't think we would get the best from him.

If he played as a specialist batsmanand we had a geniune keeper-batsman, just a 'keeper - similar to England did with Sstewart and Russell, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Is there any geniune quality openers back home that could open with Richarddson that is fit?
 

bryce

International Regular
i wouldn't even call butler a strike bowler, he is meant to be a strike bowler but it wouldn't do justice to label him a strike bowler based on his performances.

Andre said:
IMO, bowlers like Martin and Tuffey will prove cannon fodder against the Australians.
and what is butler going to be ? the aussies would love to face butler he will provide them with so many scoring opportuinites and he rarely bowls wicket balls since he cannot really swing or seam the ball, i think martin is a must play in aussie because he can extract very could bounce, he can swing the ball and also hits the seam very nicely, i would even play kyle mills ahead of butler, they may not end up being very successful but the most likely scenario is that none of the new zealand bowlers will be(maybe vettori will be an exception).
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Arjun said:
Why open with Sinclair? Fleming had a better time opening, he opens in ODI's and he's a more reliable player than that one-innings wonder.
personally, no matter how good his record has been so far, i dont think fleming should open. as ive said before hes a strokemaker, and generally strokemakers should bat at 3 or 4, and opening with richardson only makes things worse.
 

bryce

International Regular
yes that is true, fleming is at his best at number 3 and i think opening him against the aussies(in the test series anyway) would be wasting your best batting talent, IMO sinclair is playing more of a guinea pig role.

Craig there are quality, fit openers in NZ but they are all too young and it would do their confidence no good sending them over to aussie.
 

JASON

Cricketer Of The Year
Craig said:
Richardson
Sinclair
*Fleming
Styris
Astle
H.Marshall
McCullum
Oram
vettori
Franklin
Butler/C.Martin

Or;

Richardson
Sinclair
*Fleming
Styris
Astle
Oram
McCullum
Vettori
Franklin
Butler
C.Martin

Which one is the best line-up? The first XI is stronger batting wise, but only gives four bowlers plus the part-time stuff of Styris, but my second line-up is probably more balanced with more bowling options, but does Oram at 6 give a longer tail?
I think the first is the better line up . I don't think NZ can afford to play 3 fast bowlers and 1 spinner, and play Oram as an all rounder!! The batting will be weakened against a strong Aussie bowling attack!!

NZ's best hope lies in the first Test IMO, with Warne being unlikely to play and Aussies likely to play Hauritz rather than Macgill (in view of the Test being at the Gabba[Hauritz's home ground] and going by MacGill's non selection for the Indian series).

I suspect Warne or MacGill (or both) will be back for the second test.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Mister Wright said:
I think Tuffey will surprise a few people.
I thought that before the England tour - but he was clearly carrying a knock in that series, which is a contributory factor to his poor returns.

Not sure if he's recovered now?
 

Eclipse

International Debutant
If the pitches offer something Tuffy will be a good bowler if not he may get punished big time.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Mingster said:
Just like Martin proved like cannon fodder against South Africa... 8-)
1 series in which he got wickets against a very out of form side.

The rest of his career tells a very much different story - 14 games , 40 wickets @ 37.25.
 

Mingster

State Regular
marc71178 said:
1 series in which he got wickets against a very out of form side.
Did you actually watch Martin bowl in that series? SA weren't out of form in that seres, Martin just bowled superbly, and at times unplayable deliveries. He had some troubles in England because of the differen conditions and the ball, which affected his ability to swing it. Martin's shown he can be a match-winner, worth trying against the Aussies with all their left-handers.

So anyone can average 24 in NZ? Hmmm. Funny that Pollock, Ntini and among other Pakistan bowlers struggled last summer....
 

Scaly piscine

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Mingster said:
So anyone can average 24 in NZ? Hmmm. Funny that Pollock, Ntini and among other Pakistan bowlers struggled last summer....
Yes anyone can average 24 in NZ, doesn't mean everyone will. Of course if the pitches get better to bat on then that changes.
 

Kent

State 12th Man
bryce said:
yes that is true, fleming is at his best at number 3 and i think opening him against the aussies(in the test series anyway) would be wasting your best batting talent, IMO sinclair is playing more of a guinea pig role.
I can't believe how many NZers are actually keen on this.

The portion of Sinclair's test career where he's been exposed inside the first 10 overs has been a disaster. His 76 against BAN was his first score of substance in 17 innings.

Fleming on the other hand has shown signs of forming a solid opening partnership with Rigor, and it's not just the numbers that were promising. Rigor is so good at leaving the ball that bowlers tend to target a straighter, 'on the stumps' line, which should play into Fleming's strengths. If they don't re-adjust, Fleming can punch them down the ground or clip them through midwicket.

Ultimately the stats don't lie - they strongly suggest NZ has a lot more to gain by Fleming shielding Sinclair than vice versa. I could understand Fleming wanting a bit of protection if we had two openers of test quality, but sadly he seems too humble to actually want to lead from the front.

After calling Graeme Smith (averaging 61.5 as an opener) emotionally frail, Flem's not really in a position to say 'I need a guinea pig ahead of me'. It will be on Bracewell's head if we get familiar with the sight of Fleming taking guard at 3/1.
 

Macka

U19 Vice-Captain
Couldn't agree more Kent. Fleming needs to take responsibility, he has the experience and was willing to do it against England. What has changed?
 

Kent

State 12th Man
All I can suggest is that Bracewell has wilted to the pressure coming from back home to bat him at #3, a lot of it coming from Murray Deaker-types who have naively thought that what's best for Fleming must be best for the team.
 
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marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Mingster said:
He had some troubles in England because of the differen conditions and the ball, which affected his ability to swing it.
So what's his excuse for the first 11 Tests he played?
 

anzac

International Debutant
tooextracool said:
personally, no matter how good his record has been so far, i dont think fleming should open. as ive said before hes a strokemaker, and generally strokemakers should bat at 3 or 4, and opening with richardson only makes things worse.
agreed in principal - but not in context of this series with this squad........

furthermore if we are going to have a 5-5 split then Fleming must NOT open under any circumstances with this current lineup performing as it does..........

I'm only if favour of Fleming opening IF we have a 6-4 split.........
 

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