Who is more mediocre than Atherton and Hussain?

[tooextracool]

As for this thread I'm in effect comparing Atherton & Hussain mediocrity with:

Jack Russell
Alec Stewart
Graeme Hick
Mark Ramprakash (how the hell did he get 50 caps...)
Andrew Caddick
Graham Thorpe
Darren Gough
Mark Butcher
Michael Vaughan
Marcus Trescothick

Note: Mediocrity is not how good a batsman performs at Test level, think of it as a measure of a players' lack of actual cricket skill - I consider Atherton and Hussain to be very pedestrian in terms of actual cricket skill compared to the above players.

do you seriously know what 'cricket skill' means? if you think that cricket skill is how elegant a batsman is then you are the fool that you've made yourself out to be with some of the stupidest posts the forum has ever seen.
there are 4 qualities that make a batsman- technique,concentration,temperament and shot selection.
and believe me atherton and hussain were twice as good in terms of the last 3 than all those players combined(bar thorpe). atherton in fact had a much better technique than most of those players on that list.ssss

 

[Richard]

I really, really cannot see how you can criticise Atherton and Hussain and praise Mark Richardson in the same sentence. The three (and Gary Kirsten, another of my favourites) are cut from the same cloth.

Except that Richardson has played most of his Test-career on extremely flat pitches and Kirsten, Atherton and Hussain all conquered seaming and turning conditions.

 

[Steulen]

What??
Richardson plays half his Tests on wickets where even the Gods from India are happy to make it into treble figures (as a team). NZ wickets are greener and seamier than any other place in the world. Richardson has made big scores all over the world as well.
And Hussain played until last summer, so he really had the heyday of flatness on his side. Just because Atherton had those one-off heroics in SA doesn't mean he had conditions stacked against him all the time.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

What??
Richardson plays half his Tests on wickets where even the Gods from India are happy to make it into treble figures (as a team). NZ wickets are greener and seamier than any other place in the world. Richardson has made big scores all over the world as well.

Richardson learned his cricket on those wickets and the Indians learned it in totally different conditions. Silly point.

Also, Richardson only has 4 big Test scores to his name and that's counting a century as a big score.

106 v Pak in NZ
143 v Ban in NZ
145 v Ind in Ind
101 v Eng in Eng

That's not all over the world. That's at home twice, in some of the best batting conditions in the world once and on a Lord's pitch where an average of 361 runs were scored per innings over the match.

I rate Richardson, but your point is pretty poor, seeing as it's wrong.

 

[Richard]

What??
Richardson plays half his Tests on wickets where even the Gods from India are happy to make it into treble figures (as a team). NZ wickets are greener and seamier than any other place in the world. Richardson has made big scores all over the world as well.
And Hussain played until last summer, so he really had the heyday of flatness on his side. Just because Atherton had those one-off heroics in SA doesn't mean he had conditions stacked against him all the time.

He had conditions stacked against him far, far more than Richardson ever has.
I'll not deny that Richardson has played a few superb innings - none better than the 85 in the First India Test of 2002\03 - but he has had far better general batting conditions than Atherton did.
If you ask me Atherton's most important innings, meanwhile, was not that Wanderers knock but the 45 he played to swing the Lord's Test of 2000 England's way. He played plenty of others that played huge parts in their respective games, too.
And New Zealand wickets are greener and seamier than other wickets only in stereotypes.

 

[Beleg]

Also do not forget Atherton's knock in the Karachi test of 2000. That was a class act.

And New Zealand wickets are greener and seamier than other wickets only in stereotypes.

The stereotype was created mainly due to the one series against the Indians, I think.

 

[Richard]

Also do not forget Atherton's knock in the Karachi test of 2000. That was a class act.

Yes, another crucial innings in a crucial match. Not quite as important as the Lord's one, and obviously totally different skills required, but equally pivotal in the history of English cricket.

The stereotype was created mainly due to the one series against the Indians, I think.

Well, not exclusively, but that hasn't helped. The drop-in wickets for the England series before that certainly helped the seamers plenty, too. And New Zealand home pitches, so I understand, did tend to be pretty seam-friendly down the years.
Like many things, though, that's not been the case in the last 2 or 3 years.

 

[SJS]

Today(30-11-2004, 12:31 AM )
Originally Posted by Neil Pickup (on 21-10-2004, 08:04 PM )
I really, really cannot see how you can criticise Atherton and Hussain and praise Mark Richardson in the same sentence. The three (and Gary Kirsten, another of my favourites) are cut from the same cloth.

Except that Richardson has played most of his Test-career on extremely flat pitches and Kirsten, Atherton and Hussain all conquered seaming and turning conditions.

WOW !!

Very impressive indeed .

Just shows that if you are bent on arguing then time (40 odd days in this case) is no consideration and the passion of an 'arguer' never dies.

Bravo Richards !

I almost gave up looking for the post of Neil you were quoting and for you to first locate the thread and then go through it , as you must have, and find the post must be some effort. I am really amazed

 

[Richard]

Well that Scaly piscine idiot really did take the biscuit with this one, I could have replied to about 50 posts in the thread but took pity on everyone, but I just could not resist the thing about Richardson.

 

[neutralguy]

You should also add marvan attapattu to this "boring men list". he is also mediocre.

 

[Richard]

Yeah, too true.
Atapattu, while massively inconsistent, is on his day one of the best players you'll see, and certainly never fails to entertain with his beautiful strokeplay.

 

[SJS]

Well that Scaly piscine idiot really did take the biscuit with this one, I could have replied to about 50 posts in the thread but took pity on everyone, but I just could not resist the thing about Richardson.

OK. I understand the feeling. But tell me how did you know the post existed ?? You mean you go through each and every post in each and every thread when you come back after a gap. I am asking pretty seriously please.. I am genuinely curious.

 

[Richard]

OK, to bring in brilliant irony here, I've only just found-out again that SJS asked this question, so I have to dig the thing up again to answer it...
I found it because I browsed through all the stuff that was posted during my long absence due to a broken computer.
It would have been totally impossible to reply to everything - and I really felt I'd try to avoid digging-up all the tooextracool threads (15 or so of them) to continue debates that, really, were much intertwined and had their roots in very similar things.
However, this thread's title question was so ludicrous I couldn't resist reading the whole thing - mercifully most people put the idiot in his place, and his "threat" to stick marc on ignore really was revealing (if we're lucky, we'll all get put on his ignore list soon).
I saw Neil's comment about Richardson and before I knew what was happening my mouse had clicked the QR and I had typed and posted a response to his comment.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Na there's just you on the ignore list because you're one of those people that are too stupid to realise when they're wrong, so it is therefore pointless arguing with you and there's no danger of missing anything insightful anyway.

 

[Richard]

Yet there've been threats to countless people to put them on the ignore list.

 

[sledger]

Well that Scaly piscine idiot really did take the biscuit with this one, I could have replied to about 50 posts in the thread but took pity on everyone, but I just could not resist the thing about Richardson.

hehe