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Thread: What went wrong in the Ashes series?

  1. #16
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    I'd rather have Cook than Warner, I think. Might need to think about this in more detail.

  2. #17
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIMH View Post
    I'd rather have Cook than Warner, I think. Might need to think about this in more detail.
    I don't think trading Cook for Warner would be a good idea for England either, but the reasons for this are
    a) Having Bell or Root as captain could be really dire
    b) England play about half their games in England

    It does mean it's not an especially useful way to compare them though IMO. I'd definitely sooner pick Warner for a World XI type side.
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  3. #18
    Hall of Fame Member Hurricane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marty344 View Post
    Even though Australia won the last test and made it a respectable 3-2 loss to England i can't help but feel that Australia threw the fight so to speak.
    The first test it was a though Australia were not properly prepared and lost convincingly.
    The second test Australia played very well, everyone performing at their very best.
    But then in test 3 even though all the talk was on how England were rattled, they ended up winning convincingly.
    And then there was that terrible, terrible innings by Australia where they only made 60 runs and pretty much handed the Ashes back to England.

    Here are my thoughts on why the Ashes of 2015 was such a disaster.
    1) The squad was picked months before the series even began. They chose a lot of older players one of whom retired in Chris Rogers. Why would you pick someone that was going to retire after the series?? With all due respect he doesnt have much on the line if he played poorly. On top of that they initially chose Watson as the all rounder. He only playes one match then is dropped for the rest of the series??? On top of that Brad Haddin who i think is a great keeper/batsmen was dropped after missing a test for personal reasons and was not allowed to play out the rest of the series and potentially his last tour of England. How utterly disrespectful to someone who has done do much.

    2) In terms of batting, i dont understand why Warner is the opener, for every hundred he scored he has 5 other innings where he gets out cheaply for few runs. Why not put him down the order and let him attack the bowlers and play the same role Gilchrist did.
    3) Why not have both Marsh brothers in the team? its no like it hasnt been done before, there was the Chappele brothers and the Waugh twins. Plus they are both great batsmen with runs on the board, and one of them being a proper all rounder.
    4) If they chose Siddle for the last test why didnt they pick him for the last test???

    Yes, Clarke has to pay the price for Australia's poor showing, but what about others. Surely the selectors need to be seriously looked at. And the coach too. Why should Leahmen be let off the hook for such a dismal performance in the 4th test. Back to Clarke why couldnt he have given the reigns to Smith when he took over as Captain against India.

    I think one good idea would be to have a separate captain for each form of the game. Idea number two, if a player is chosen to play at the start of a series then they should be allowed / given the opportunity to play the whole series. If they fail miserably, then let them go afterwards, but dont humiliate them, like what they did with Watson and Haddin.
    Idea three the captain should get a big say in who is in their side or set it up so that the captains choice for a player is worth 2 votes or something. Idea four, with all due respect to the county sides, they are not good preperation for the Australia side. They should be allowed to have a four day match against another nation, even Ireland before beginning the Ashes.

    That is just a few of my thoughts. Does anyone agree, disagree, or have other thoughts.
    I agree and disagree with you on Warner. I think on this tour he proved he can open in testing conditions so I disagree with you there.
    Where I agree with you is that it is not his natural position. Warner dropping down the order to say number 5 for example, would lead to him being completely prolific - and even people like me would admire his aggressive strokeplay.
    At number 5 he could possibly challenge Smith and DeVilliers for the number one batting ranking in the world if he hit a purple patch.
    Sehwag was also better suited to being down the order at say number 4.

    But it is what it is, they open(ed), and there won't be any changes to Warner's batting position.
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  4. #19
    International Captain mr_mister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marty344 View Post
    And the coach too. Why should Leahmen be let off the hook for such a dismal performance in the 4th test. .


    Because it wasn't his fault his players decided to play rash shots and nick every ball? I dont get the logic behind dropping a coach for something like this. It was also just Broad's day. Like, do we think Lehmann gave orders for his players to play the way they did?


  5. #20
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Do you actually think the reason they didn't both play in the same game is because the selectors have a Marsh quota and/or an aversion to picking brothers? The fact that brothers have played together before or indeed even the fact that they're brothers at all is more or less irrelevant.

    This also again contradicts your complaint about Watson being dropped unless you're claiming you wanted to drop Clarke before the series -- in which case I call bull****. There aren't enough places in the team to play Mitch Marsh, Shaun Marsh and Shane Watson given Smith and Clarke were rightly auto-picks.
    Oh get with it PEWS, clearly S Marsh and Watson open (as Rogers is dropped for wanting to retire and Warner is batting 7), then there's space for Smith, Clarke and M Marsh at 3-5 and Haddin at 6 - simples.
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  6. #21
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    Oh get with it PEWS, clearly S Marsh and Watson open (as Rogers is dropped for wanting to retire and Warner is batting 7), then there's space for Smith, Clarke and M Marsh at 3-5 and Haddin at 6 - simples.
    How silly of me.

  7. #22
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Cook vs. Warner is close, it maybe would depend on who my other opener is I reckon.
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  8. #23
    International Regular Tangles's Avatar
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    Rogers retiring and a lack of options gives Warner a lot of security in the team. I would like him to score more 1st innings runs and have less brain explosions once set but that's not likely to happen. Some match awareness wouldn't go astray either. His aggressive style comes with risks but it works really well at home. So well he just always bats in that mode. If they punt on Bancroft the team can't afford that every innings.

  9. #24
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    Cook vs. Warner is close, it maybe would depend on who my other opener is I reckon.
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  10. #25
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Because Cook would wahhh about Warner being a douche, and Warner would find Cook boring as bat ****.

  11. #26
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend NUFAN's Avatar
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    Thread plot twist:
    What went right these Ashes?

    - only as good as your last game
    - Peter Siddle
    - Nathan Lyon stood up
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  12. #27
    International Captain stephen's Avatar
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    I thought that Warner batted really well in this Ashes series, despite being undone by a few good balls. If he failed at all, it was at converting his starts into big hundreds. He never really got out being too aggressive at the start of his innings.

  13. #28
    Evil Scotsman Furball's Avatar
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    Yeah Warner was generally getting out to good bowling rather than playing dumb shots like his middle order colleagues.

    Grafted his way to an absolute shocker of a 50 2nd dig at Cardiff when the ball just seemed determined to only find the edge of his bat; lack of application at the crease is not an accusation that could be levelled at Warner this series.
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  14. #29
    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    He played a few dumb shots, but usually when set. If a few of our middle order colleagues had at least gotten that far (except Cardiff. God that ****ed us over) then we might be talking about a very different series.

  15. #30
    Cricket Web Staff Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    1st dig at Lords was heaps him getting greedy.
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