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View Poll Results: Who will win?

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  • England

    8 20.51%
  • Australia

    25 64.10%
  • Draw (crims retain)

    6 15.38%
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Thread: 4th thread - who's going to win?

  1. #91
    123/5 Flem274*'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    England were good. They were the second best side in the world, behind South Africa, and it was even close between those two for a wee while.

    Broad and Anderson were up there with the best new ball pairs. Tremlett and Finn were actually taking wickets. Swann was one of the best spinners. Cook was going to overtake Sachin. Trott could not be got out. Pietersen could turn games singlehandedly. Prior was one of the best keeper-bats. And Ian Bell did his downhill skiing thing.

    They won a series in India against a pretty good side in Indian conditions. Won the Ashes obviously. Pakistan exposed them I suppose but Pakistan does that to everyone.

    I do agree that they should stop comparing themselves to Australia.
    Nah I think England may well have been #2 as well but Prior was the best keeper bat by light years. He was always the best. Let's not let recent Ashes revisionism belittle him here.
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  2. #92
    Evil Scotsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemon View Post
    nope
    Cook, Trott, Bell, Prior, Swann and Anderson would have strolled into any World XI in that period of time.

    England's bowling attack was clearly the best in the world and the batting unit was damn strong with pretty much no passengers besides Morgan.

  3. #93
    Hall of Fame Member Pothas's Avatar
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    Was that not also the time when South Africa had loads of drawn series, especially at home? You kind of always felt they had the better players (long term anyway) but there is no way they were a better side at the time.

  4. #94
    Global Moderator Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Yeah, South Africa drew with India at home (year after drawing with England) while England beat India 4-0. I don't think they had better players either. Guys like Petersen, Paul Harris, Prince, Tsotsobe were pretty meh. Only Morgan and late Collingwood were at that level. As Vic said in the summer of 2011 it was undebatable. But then Philander arrived, Boucher retired meaning AB took the gloves and Duminy came in to bat 7, who had improved a lot. England started losing games in Asia and guys like Bresnan, Trott and Bell regressed from God like to average or poor. I don't think the rankings ever lied in that period tbh.
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  5. #95
    Evil Scotsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pothas View Post
    Was that not also the time when South Africa had loads of drawn series, especially at home? You kind of always felt they had the better players (long term anyway) but there is no way they were a better side at the time.
    Drew at home to India and Australia IIRC.

  6. #96
    Global Moderator Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Furball View Post
    Drew at home to India and Australia IIRC.
    And lost to a decent but hardly incredible Australia 2009 team.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabinet96 View Post
    And lost to a decent but hardly incredible Australia 2009 team.
    Johnson fired in that series. Only reason it played out like it did.

    The gap between his best and worst back then was unbelievably ridiculous. I'm not sure I've seen anything else like it in sport.

  8. #98
    International Debutant Salamuddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    England were good. They were the second best side in the world, behind South Africa, and it was even close between those two for a wee while.

    Broad and Anderson were up there with the best new ball pairs. Tremlett and Finn were actually taking wickets. Swann was one of the best spinners. Cook was going to overtake Sachin. Trott could not be got out. Pietersen could turn games singlehandedly. Prior was one of the best keeper-bats. And Ian Bell did his downhill skiing thing.

    They won a series in India against a pretty good side in Indian conditions. Won the Ashes obviously. Pakistan exposed them I suppose but Pakistan does that to everyone.

    I do agree that they should stop comparing themselves to Australia.
    Very questionable whether that Indian side was very good. England faced probably the weakest side India put out in a home series in a generation.

    Sehwag, Gambhir, Tendulkar and Zaheer were all well past their best. Kohli, Pujara, Ashwin were all still rookies. On top of that Yadav got injured after his match winning performance in the first test at Ahmedabad.

    The truth is that series win probably masked over the weakness inherent in the England side - they were luckly to get away with a draw in NZ shortly afterwards and obvioulsy got demolished in Oz a year later.
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  9. #99
    International Debutant Salamuddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    England were good. They were the second best side in the world, behind South Africa, and it was even close between those two for a wee while.

    Broad and Anderson were up there with the best new ball pairs. Tremlett and Finn were actually taking wickets. Swann was one of the best spinners. Cook was going to overtake Sachin. Trott could not be got out. Pietersen could turn games singlehandedly. Prior was one of the best keeper-bats. And Ian Bell did his downhill skiing thing.

    They won a series in India against a pretty good side in Indian conditions. Won the Ashes obviously. Pakistan exposed them I suppose but Pakistan does that to everyone.

    I do agree that they should stop comparing themselves to Australia.
    England were never really going to stay number 1 for that long. I'm not sure they ever had the bowling attack to do so.
    Anderson is a fine bowler but a step below Dale Steyn and probably also the current Aussie quicks. Broad is good in English conditions but mediocre outside.
    SWann's best performances came against the weaker batting lineup.
    The third seamer position was always a revolving door.

    They just never had a truly consistent, versatile and well rounded attack which a team that aspires to stay number 1 for a lengthy period of time.
    They got away with in English conditions more often than not but they were exposed away from home.
    Last edited by Salamuddin; 15-06-2015 at 06:21 AM.

  10. #100
    Global Moderator Cabinet96's Avatar
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    It was hardly the bowling that let them down in Sri Lanka and the UAE though. Signs that the bowling was losing it's way didn't really arrive until 2013 in NZ (no Swann) and the Ashes in Australia a year after that.

  11. #101
    International Debutant Salamuddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIMH View Post
    Nah through 2011 we were the best in the world.

    Basically what jack said
    Bull****. England pretty much lost any legitimate claim to being number 1 when they got hammered 3-0 away by an average Pakistan side.

  12. #102
    Global Moderator Cabinet96's Avatar
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    Luckily that was in 2012.

  13. #103
    International Debutant Salamuddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabinet96 View Post
    Luckily that was in 2012.
    Even so
    Can't see how England could ever claim to be number 1 in 2011 when they hadn't won on the subcontinent or beaten South AFrica (home or away).

  14. #104
    Hall of Fame Member Pothas's Avatar
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    So you have to beat everyone to be the best side in the world? I thought you just had to be better than everyone else.

  15. #105
    International Debutant Salamuddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pothas View Post
    So you have to beat everyone to be the best side in the world? I thought you just had to be better than everyone else.
    How were they better than South AFrica though ?

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