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Thread: In the event that Clarke's back gives out during this series and he has to retire...

  1. #16
    Cricket Web Staff Member / Global Moderator Neil Pickup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    Nup. Just doesn't work. Fast bowling is hard work and if you're bowling a long spell it's hard to set your own fields and one for the guy at the other end as well. I firmly believe it doesn't work

    Test cricket has never seen a truly great fast bowling captain, apart from maybe Imran.
    Fast bowlers have 20 overs a day to get through, and struggle to balance playing and captaincy.

    So why is everyone so much more keen to give the armband to a keeper who's got 90 overs of squats, 500 takes, and a batting role to fulfil?

    People say there have been few bowler-captains; how many keeper-skippers have there been? I know I cannot stand trying to do both roles!

  2. #17
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Dhoni the exception that proves, etc.

    Stewie did both too, didn't he? Whilst opening and drivng the team bus as well, no doubt.
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  3. #18
    Cricket Web Staff Member / Global Moderator Neil Pickup's Avatar
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    ... and we all know how well Stewie prospered by trying to wear half a dozen hats at the same time.

    Fair shout on Dhoni, mind. Although he doesn't usually have that much work to do when India are bowling...

  4. #19
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Pickup View Post
    Fast bowlers have 20 overs a day to get through, and struggle to balance playing and captaincy.

    So why is everyone so much more keen to give the armband to a keeper who's got 90 overs of squats, 500 takes, and a batting role to fulfil?

    People say there have been few bowler-captains; how many keeper-skippers have there been? I know I cannot stand trying to do both roles!
    Haddin was quite a good skipper for NSW when he did it though, and his own performance lifted so he seemed to enjoy it.
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  5. #20
    State Vice-Captain MrPrez's Avatar
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    Sanga, though that didn't work well.
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    Didn't Junior Murray captain for WI at one point? Andy Flower? Dave Houghton? Ridley Jacobs?

    I don't think they all kept and captained but there will be a few in there. Flower I know.
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    Disclaimer: I am a biased South African. Anything I say is likely to have something in it that ultimately favours the Proteas.

  6. #21
    Hall of Fame Member Howe_zat's Avatar
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    I'm sure there are far more wicketkeeping captains than bowling captains. Two more examples would be Read and Foster having had the captaincy of their counties for years.
    And we still haven't walked in the glow of each other's majestic presence.

  7. #22
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Reckon the advantages a keeper/captain has are a really good view of the field/what's happening, and an objective opinion on what's happening.

    That's one of the hard things about being a bowler/captain imo, knowing when to bowl yourself, and also when to drag yourself.

    Australia's only bowling captains have been- Benaud, Lindwall (1 test), Johnson, Ryder, Trumble, (2 tests), Giffen.

    Of those, only Lindwall and Ryder were pace bowlers. Lindwall only filled in for one test, and Ryder captained for 5.

  8. #23
    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    TBF there's been quite a lot of fast bowling allrounders (or at least bowlers with batting pretensions) who've captained for a while with varying degrees of success: Imran, Gubby Allen, Hadlee, Pollock, Grieg, Botham, Flintoff, Wasim, Kapil Dev and Sobers off the top of my head.

    Not so many specialist quicks tho. Wallis and Walsh the only two I can think of who've done it regularly but there's doubtless others too.

    Is there maybe still a slight hint of the class divide in operation here? Quicks are the yeoman of cricket and batsmen are more likely to be of the officer class.

  9. #24
    International Coach flibbertyjibber's Avatar
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    Isn't Haddin nominated as number 1 candidate due to a lack of other realistic options though more than he would be the best man for the job?

  10. #25
    International Debutant adub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    Reckon the advantages a keeper/captain has are a really good view of the field/what's happening, and an objective opinion on what's happening.
    I always liked keeping and captaining for those reasons. You really knew how well your bowlers are going (how good their line was, how much movement they were getting, how quick it was coming through) and could see when they needed a break quicker. I also felt I had a better view of the angles for field placing etc from behind the stumps than if I was at say mid off. Also it's the best place to get in the batsman's ear.

    Obvs a lot more going on at Test level but I think the Keepers Can't Captain thing is a bit of a croc. In the current side Hadds is the only real option and his NSW efforts would indicate he'd do a good job.

  11. #26
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoyBrumby View Post
    Is there maybe still a slight hint of the class divide in operation here? Quicks are the yeoman of cricket and batsmen are more likely to be of the officer class.
    Good point there. Probably wouldn't have seen many quick bowling captains in cricket's early days because they were nearly all amateurs.

  12. #27
    Request Your Custom Title Now! benchmark00's Avatar
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    Can't captain from fine leg.

    Anyway, bowlers shouldn't be captain as they have a conflict of interest, generally leads to them bowling themselves too much or not enough.

    Also better to have a batsman captain because they probably know how batsmen think and are better at picking up subtle weaknesses when they're batting, something which is hard to do when the captain is bowling or, again, sitting at fine leg.

    Then there's always the fact that fast bowlers are one ball away from an injury...
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    Kohli. Do something in test cricket for once please.

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  13. #28
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    Clarke plays even with no back imo.

  14. #29
    International Vice-Captain Riggins's Avatar
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    Have they actually said what's wrong with his back, other than it gets stiff and sore?
    The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament.

  15. #30
    Request Your Custom Title Now! benchmark00's Avatar
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    Shaggers back.

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