*Official* Road to the 2010/11 Ashes

[fredfertang]

Tremlett could just say he was Mark Webber and get in that way

 

[tooextracool]

Biggest poser is who, if anyone, misses out for Ding Dong when his metatarsal heals IMHO. Currently only really the skipper and Colly looking totally safe. Even St Kevin needs some runs to be completely sure, especially if Eoin kicks on.

If Cook misses out who'll open and if Trott misses out who bats #3?

Im fairly certain that if Trott misses out, Bell will bat at 3.

 

[Furball]

If Trott misses out KP should be told he's batting 3.

 

[Uppercut]

Michael Holding's first series in Australia, got smashed but everyone saw the potential, etc. Probable truth is that he may not play enough FC cricket and the WI not enough Tests for him to become really good.

Indeed. Roach announced his fantastic potential to the world in Australia, but he didn't bowl well. Didn't get the job done. No one really does in Australia though, Dale Steyn aside.

In any case, you can't exactly hold him up as a bowler Finn would hope to emulate. The idea that bang-it-in bowlers will be successful in Australia is merely a theory with not much evidence to support it. As with spinners in India, the fact that they're well-suited to the pitches is countered by the fact that the Aussie batsmen play such bowlers exceptionally well. Bowling against Australia in Australia over the past ten years. Huge task on Finn's hands.

 

[vcs]

Yeah, Ishant bowled some superb spells but Irfan Pathan and RP Singh are not bang-it-in bowlers and they also did equally well in the final analysis at Perth.

 

[Top_Cat]

Adaptability the name of the game in Australia. Just nibbling away at off peg probably won't be enough on pitches other than Adelaide. On the others, need to mix up length/pace/crease position. If something isn't working, try something else. And fast. Sticking with one method won't work, especially since this Aussie batting line-up seems to be quite unsettled when weirs **** starts happening.

Doesn't have to be big variations either. McG was so successful in Brisbane because he bowled with a bit of conventional swing when the ball was new, nibbled it around in his middle spell and reversed it a bit later. Makes him just unpredictable enough without being inconsistent.

 

[Uppercut]

Accuracy the key for me. Same as anywhere else, in fact. Pitches are flat, but it's not like bowling in India where even if you find an edge it's likely to drop short. If you get the ball in the right spot often enough, the wickets will come- as McGrath showed, you only need the tiniest bit of lateral movement if you're hitting the right spot. And likewise, with the ball coming onto the bat so well, you rarely get away with a loose delivery. Especially bowling to Australia since they can pull the ball off a length so well. Ideally you want to find the right spot and keep putting the ball there. As far as bowling to Australia in Australia goes, Curtly Ambrose was the undisputed master.

 

[tooextracool]

If Trott misses out KP should be told he's batting 3.

Ideally, KP should be told to bat at 3 regardless. Neither Bell nor Trott are test match number 3's in my book. It could be argued that nor is KP but hes the most talented of the lot and hes also most likely to succeed at 3.

 

[tooextracool]

Indeed. Roach announced his fantastic potential to the world in Australia, but he didn't bowl well. Didn't get the job done. No one really does in Australia though, Dale Steyn aside.
In any case, you can't exactly hold him up as a bowler Finn would hope to emulate. The idea that bang-it-in bowlers will be successful in Australia is merely a theory with not much evidence to support it. As with spinners in India, the fact that they're well-suited to the pitches is countered by the fact that the Aussie batsmen play such bowlers exceptionally well. Bowling against Australia in Australia over the past ten years. Huge task on Finn's hands.

Interesting list that. I was actually interested in looking up those stats myself, just goes to show how hard fast bowlers have had it in Australia over the years. Also puts Flintoff's and Hoggard's efforts down under in perspective, given the batting lineup that they were faced with that was a pretty good performance(always thought Flintoff bowled well that tour but didnt have the stats to reflect it). Steyn and Nel may have bowled against more brittle bowling lineups but even then their performances down under were exceptional

 

[BoyBrumby]

Ideally, KP should be told to bat at 3 regardless. Neither Bell nor Trott are test match number 3's in my book. It could be argued that nor is KP but hes the most talented of the lot and hes also most likely to succeed at 3.

Think KP needs to be told a few home truths, myself. When he was gunning it he deserved a little lattitude, but now his performances have tailed off so dramatically he's lost that right, IMHO.

Problem with our batting line up is we seven top six test class players, but none are really test #3s. Two openers (Cook & Strauss), two #4s in Trott and KP & three blokes in Colly, Bell and Morgan who all seem to be natural #6s.

Early days yet, but Morgan arguably has the best temperament for #3 of all of them. Just whether he also has the technique.

 

[Furball]

Think KP needs to be told a few home truths, myself. When he was gunning it he deserved a little lattitude, but now his performances have tailed off so dramatically he's lost that right, IMHO.

Problem with our batting line up is we seven top six test class players, but none are really test #3s. Two openers (Cook & Strauss), two #4s in Trott and KP & three blokes in Colly, Bell and Morgan who all seem to be natural #6s.

Early days yet, but Morgan arguably has the best temperament for #3 of all of them. Just whether he also has the technique.

It's a curiously English problem which affects the ODI side as well: Flintoff, Collingwood and Pietersen have all produced their best work at 5.

edit: looking at number 3s, Nasser Hussain was suprisingly good in the 90s: 1513 runs @ 50.43, putting him behind only Lara and Dravid of all number 3s who scored at least 1500 runs there in the 90s.

http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/engine...0;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

The 2000s list

 

[Uppercut]

Think KP needs to be told a few home truths, myself. When he was gunning it he deserved a little lattitude, but now his performances have tailed off so dramatically he's lost that right, IMHO.

Problem with our batting line up is we seven top six test class players, but none are really test #3s. Two openers (Cook & Strauss), two #4s in Trott and KP & three blokes in Colly, Bell and Morgan who all seem to be natural #6s.

Early days yet, but Morgan arguably has the best temperament for #3 of all of them. Just whether he also has the technique.

Morgan at #3 isn't ideal either. Plays spin exceptionally well for an England player and you have him coming in against pace 9 times out of 10.

I'd just stick with Trott. He's a test-class player, in my mind there's no doubt about that. He might never conquer the number 3 position but I think he's got a better chance than anyone else. Unless some bright young thing really knocks down the door I think it's best just to take what you're given with Trott for the time being.

 

[tombarlow123]

I see no problem with Trott at number 3. In fact I've been very impressed by his game in the last few months - what happened in South Africa was a result of him being rushed into the frame without much notice at an unfamiliar position. What will test his no. 3 credentials will be the Ashes at the end of the year and I'm fairly sure he will make that team.

 

[Johnners]

Ugh, here's something for all English fans to look forward to. If he fails in India, yet is still picked for the first ashes test it's an absolute joke.

Bit of a rubbish comment from English re: Watto as well imo, it's become rather obvious that he's better suited to batting down the order so he's hardly "batting out of position".

 

[George.Hinton]

I'd pick

Strauss
Cook
Trott
KP
Colly
Eoin
Prior
Broad
Swann
Finn
Jimmeh

Rashid
Bell
Shehzad
Onions (if fit otherwise Plunkett)
Kieswetter

 

[GotSpin]

Question for the guys in Brisbane. What are the chances of the test being completely sold out before the day? I'm probably going to go on a road trip from Sydney to the Gabba and I was wondering if we should book our tickets beforehand or will there be a couple left over at the door

 

[Johnners]

Depends what day you're going on. Last time around first 2-3 days were sold out iirc before the day

 

[GotSpin]

We'd be aiming to go potentially all five days since we're driving so far

 

[Johnners]

I'd definitely pre-book then.

 

[GotSpin]

Cheers