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How would the other teams have done?

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
Mind you I'd still back them to win, Garner, Marshall, Holding, Croft, Roberts, Walsh, Ambrose,,,, nowhere to run baby.
I can't even see where a run would come from? Who would you target to get runs from in a line up of Ambrose- Holding - Marshall - Garner? I guess you'd have to go with Holding as the "weak" link, LOL!
 
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Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
so 3 out of 7 batsmen playing well for the entire series is ideal then?
very rarely do the entire 7 play well for an entire 3 test series 8-)

Ponting, Hussey & Hayden were the main batsmen, but Symonds, Hodge & Gilchrist all at some stage played an important role with the bat.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
1-0? And thats while being dominated in Sydney for most of the game.
Like i said earlier, SA have a considerably worse batting lineup, and that hurt them during that series.IMO they bowled far better than Australia did.
erm... 2-0. Cry all you like about how Australia were dominated at Sydney they won, just like Australia were dominant at Perth, yet it was a draw 8-)
 

tooextracool

International Coach
erm... 2-0. Cry all you like about how Australia were dominated at Sydney they won, just like Australia were dominant at Perth, yet it was a draw 8-)
Because of course it rained in perth did it?Had it not rained, SA would have in all probability have won that game in Sydney. Even if it were 0-0 it would have been a draw and SA would not have declared and you know it.
And Australia dominating at perth, is this a joke?You had 5 whole days to win that test match. Not only could you not win in 5 days(which is basically the whole point of test cricket) you also managed to concede a lead in the first innings.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
very rarely do the entire 7 play well for an entire 3 test series 8-)

Ponting, Hussey & Hayden were the main batsmen, but Symonds, Hodge & Gilchrist all at some stage played an important role with the bat.
there is no need for 7 to play well for the entire series. However when just 3 of them(less than half) do so, it begs the question of how much does the batting rely around them.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Because of course it rained in perth did it?Had it not rained, SA would have in all probability have won that game in Sydney. Even if it were 0-0 it would have been a draw and SA would not have declared and you know it.
And Australia dominating at perth, is this a joke?You had 5 whole days to win that test match. Not only could you not win in 5 days(which is basically the whole point of test cricket) you also managed to concede a lead in the first innings.
Speculate about the rain all you like, SA didn't win, how hard is that to understand 8-)

no they didn't win, thanks to a mammoth batting performance from Rudolph, but it doesn't deny the fact that from day 3 onwards Australia were in the dominant position.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
there is no need for 7 to play well for the entire series. However when just 3 of them(less than half) do so, it begs the question of how much does the batting rely around them.
Might as well beg that question every series then. More often than not you have 3/4 batsmen who were in better form than the rest of them, and the batting revolves around those players. I honestly don't see what was so different about this series from any other in that regard
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Might as well beg that question every series then. More often than not you have 3/4 batsmen who were in better form than the rest of them, and the batting revolves around those players. I honestly don't see what was so different about this series from any other in that regard
Its not a case of better form. 3 out of 4 of those players( Gilchrist, Hodge and Symonds) had technical frailities exposed. When was the last time you've seen something like that happen and yet seen a side win?
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Speculate about the rain all you like, SA didn't win, how hard is that to understand 8-) .
and how hard is it to understand that they didnt deserve to because of the rain? Its much like saying England deserved to beat SA in the semi final of the 92 WC or that England deserved their win at supersport park in 99/00 after Cronje's declaration.

no they didn't win, thanks to a mammoth batting performance from Rudolph, but it doesn't deny the fact that from day 3 onwards Australia were in the dominant position.
Err any team that batted first would be in a better position on that pitch.Its not like SA were 8 or 9 wickets down and on the verge of losing.
Like i said you couldnt win the game in 5 days, how could you honestly compare it to a game that had some 100 overs lost due to rain?
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Err any team that batted first would be in a better position on that pitch.Its not like SA were 8 or 9 wickets down and on the verge of losing.
Like i said you couldnt win the game in 5 days, how could you honestly compare it to a game that had some 100 overs lost due to rain?

the only comparison i made was that Australia were in a dominant position & drew, SA were in a dominant position and were rather comfortably beaten. In anycase, that wasn't the point i was trying to make. I was trying to point out taht you can speculate all you want, and dribble on about the would'ves, could'ves & maybe's all you like, but the fact remains Australia won that series 2-0.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
the only comparison i made was that Australia were in a dominant position & drew, SA were in a dominant position and were rather comfortably beaten. In anycase, that wasn't the point i was trying to make. I was trying to point out taht you can speculate all you want, and dribble on about the would'ves, could'ves & maybe's all you like, but the fact remains Australia won that series 2-0.
Its not speculation, ive removed that result all together. SA were only 'rather comfortably beaten' for reasons that was beyond their control rather than on field performance. Like it or not there isnt anything that can be done about Ntini getting injured, rain interruptions, or for that matter being forced to declare in a not so dominant position to give yourself a chance of winning.
At the end of the day the 2-0 isnt a very accurate reflection of how close the series was as it should have been 1-1 or 1-0 as Australia would not have won the game had it not rained.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Its not a case of better form. 3 out of 4 of those players( Gilchrist, Hodge and Symonds) had technical frailities exposed. When was the last time you've seen something like that happen and yet seen a side win?
Granted for Symonds & Hodge, but it was quite clear that Glichrist was out of form (he couldn't even manage runs against WI, and his 86 was scratchy), as was Langer.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Granted for Symonds & Hodge, but it was quite clear that Glichrist was out of form (he couldn't even manage runs against WI, and his 86 was scratchy), as was Langer.
Commone, Kallis and Nel both had him in knots when they went around the wicket to him. I dont think anyone can deny that Gilchrist has struggled only after that ploy came into effect.
Langer was perhaps not worked out as such, but he looked quite uncomfortable out there when he batted.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Its not speculation, ive removed that result all together. SA were only 'rather comfortably beaten' for reasons that was beyond their control rather than on field performance. Like it or not there isnt anything that can be done about Ntini getting injured, rain interruptions, or for that matter being forced to declare in a not so dominant position to give yourself a chance of winning.
At the end of the day the 2-0 isnt a very accurate reflection of how close the series was as it should have been 1-1 or 1-0 as Australia would not have won the game had it not rained.
How do you know that Australia wouldn't have won it had it not rained? Ponting managed to blast 142 without looking troubled, and given the form he was in, he quite easily could've led Australia to a victory with a larger total to chase had it not been a rain affected match.
 

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Commone, Kallis and Nel both had him in knots when they went around the wicket to him. I dont think anyone can deny that Gilchrist has struggled only after that ploy came into effect.
Langer was perhaps not worked out as such, but he looked quite uncomfortable out there when he batted.
Yeah he has struggled, but imo his lack of runs was just as much to do with poor form as it was the round the wicket ploy. Even in his 86 at Sydney he didn't look in good touch at all with a helluva lot of shots not meeting anything near the middle of the bat.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
How do you know that Australia wouldn't have won it had it not rained? Ponting managed to blast 142 without looking troubled, and given the form he was in, he quite easily could've led Australia to a victory with a larger total to chase had it not been a rain affected match.
Because Australia didnt even manage to bowl them out once in the whole game? SA would quite easily have batted out the draw if they wanted to do so especially when you consider they batted some 150 overs in the first innings.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Yeah he has struggled, but imo his lack of runs was just as much to do with poor form as it was the round the wicket ploy. Even in his 86 at Sydney he didn't look in good touch at all with a helluva lot of shots not meeting anything near the middle of the bat.
being out of form for 1.5 years is not an excuse. It cannot be coincidence that his slump began during and after the ashes of 2005. IMO his poor form was merely a consequence of not being able to play the round the wicket ploy.
 

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