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Thread: Andrew Flintoff as a leader of men

  1. #1
    Soutie Langeveldt's Avatar
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    Andrew Flintoff as a leader of men

    Okay his quality is not doubted, but what most worries me about the recent Ashes performances is his inability to criticize during his interviews..

    He may be a really happy chap and a pleasure to play for, but bleating on about the "positives" when you have smacked 500+ and still been hammered leaves a little bit to be desired.. Maybe he would be more effective if he concentrated on kicking some ass rather than trying not to demoralise any of his players..
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    International Coach PhoenixFire's Avatar
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    To be fair, I don't really think it matters what he says in public, what matters really is what he says to his troops in the camp.
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    International Coach Barney Rubble's Avatar
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    Too much of a nice guy I think. I can't imagine him ever delivering a rocket up anyone's backside if necessary. For example, KP really need a word or two after stupidly giving away those overthrows, but all Fred did was stand there looking annoyed.

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    International Coach PhoenixFire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barney Rubble
    Too much of a nice guy I think. I can't imagine him ever delivering a rocket up anyone's backside if necessary. For example, KP really need a word or two after stupidly giving away those overthrows, but all Fred did was stand there looking annoyed.
    That look said a 1000 words


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    He captained poorly.

    Let that Warne, Clarke partnership build by continuously bowling Giles over the wicket to Warne and getting milked for easy singles. Didn't change anything, wasn't proactive.

    What a joke, so they were admitting they didn't think they were capable of getting a tail endering slogger out. Giles is such an embarrassment.

    I have no doubt that Warne wouln't have been able to resist from around, but they didn't even try it.

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    It was his tactics in the second innings that were more baffling. He spread the field from the first ball and allowed them to pick up singles at their leisure. England's only chance was to take early wickets and make Australia re-assess their ambitions. He should have started with an orthodox field with the new ball.

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    Hall of Fame Member steds's Avatar
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    For someone who supposedly got the job partly because he could "get the best out of Harmison", he does a bloody good job of convincing me he doesn't trust the rest of his bowling attack (hence him ending up bowling excessively like vs. Sri Lanka).

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    Looking back, nother thing I found hilarious is that after the first test when asked whether he would keep Harmisson opening the bowling or himself, he firmly replied, no no I am a first change bowler and we have guys who are better suited to doing that job.

    Yeah OK. So that'll be Flintoff opening in both innings and at the beginning of the day then.

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    No doubting Flintoff's talent as a player. Too nice a guy to be a leader. Harmison is a professional player, is he not? Instead of treating him like an under 12 player and patting him on the back for getting one on the pitch, maybe a kick in the butt and told to do his job would have some better results. Treat him like a man, not a baby.
    You think being tough as a leader brings bad results? Ian Chappel wasn't soft, Steve Waugh, ect ect.
    The better teams have always been led by a strong leader, not just a good mate.
    Those KP overthows is a prime example. KP was clearly going to do that before it happened, the commentaters mentioned it, you could see it on TV, he threw a few wildly before that one finally went astray. A captians word before that would've stopped it before it happened. An unfriendly look after the fact. I wish he was my boss.

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    Cricketer Of The Year wpdavid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langeveldt
    Okay his quality is not doubted, but what most worries me about the recent Ashes performances is his inability to criticize during his interviews..

    He may be a really happy chap and a pleasure to play for, but bleating on about the "positives" when you have smacked 500+ and still been hammered leaves a little bit to be desired.. Maybe he would be more effective if he concentrated on kicking some ass rather than trying not to demoralise any of his players..
    tbf interviews aren't the place to do that. Neither is the field of play the place to offer major bollockings. Criticism should be a private affair, and we don't really know what goes on behind the scenes. Like you, I get the impression he's not up to that part of the job though, but it's gueswork on our part. There's enough other reasons why I don't think he should be captain anyway.

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    International Coach Barney Rubble's Avatar
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    He's clearly losing the respect and/or faith of at least some of the players - Saj Mahmood's public criticism of him today must have stung, especially from one of his county teammates. Don't think he's up to the job. Give it to Strauss ASAP.

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    International Coach PhoenixFire's Avatar
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    Strauss should have had it from the start. He has a better tactical knowhow, seems to be more articulate, doesn't have to cope with bowling as well, and seems to be a much cooler and calmer bloke than Fred. Bollocks to the motivational crap, if players can't motivate themselves to play for their country, then they have a big problem.

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    International Coach Barney Rubble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixFire
    Strauss should have had it from the start. He has a better tactical knowhow, seems to be more articulate, doesn't have to cope with bowling as well, and seems to be a much cooler and calmer bloke than Fred. Bollocks to the motivational crap, if players can't motivate themselves to play for their country, then they have a big problem.
    Exactly right. No man with three wins in four Tests deserves to be unceremoniously turfed back into the ranks like that.

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    International Coach PhoenixFire's Avatar
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    The whole 5-0 (Sri Lanka ODI series) argument is totally invalid. Not only was he given **** players like Tim Bresnan to work with, the players that were supposedly 'senior' and 'expirienced', played just as bad.

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    International Coach Barney Rubble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixFire
    The whole 5-0 (Sri Lanka ODI series) argument is totally invalid. Not only was he given **** players like Tim Bresnan to work with, the players that were supposedly 'senior' and 'expirienced', played just as bad.
    Exactly right once again. It's not like he made any bad decisions. He just didn't have any good options available to choose.

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