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Thread: ***Official*** 3rd Test at the WACA

  1. #91
    International Captain Dravid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt79
    But Lee bowled very well today. The guy has carried the pace attack with Clark for the last year, and after 1 and a half bad matches, the half being on an extremely flat track, you want to drop him?
    No, I just want to try McGill and Johnson.

  2. #92
    Hall of Fame Member FaaipDeOiad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    Yeah, you're right. Brett Lee has an amazing ability of avoiding the selection axe like no other player. Even when he was averaging 50 against England in 2001 he still managed to stay in the side for the 5th test. Even after averaging 31 against Bangladesh and 37 against Zimbabwe he still manages to hold his spot without question.
    Nice effort in missing the point to have a random dig at Lee.
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  3. #93
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  4. #94
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FaaipDeOiad
    I actually agree with aussie about having Hussey at 5. I'm pretty sure they'll stick him at 4, but I like him at 5 or 6 for a few reasons. It really adds a lot of stability to our middle order, and batting at 5 and 6 isn't any easier than batting at 3 or 4, it just tests different skills. Hussey's ability to bat with the lower order and the high price he puts on his wicket makes him perfect at 5 or 6, and I'd be quite happy seeing Clarke or Watson at 4. Clarke is obviously the more realistic option at this point. It's also worth remembering the way Clarke and Watson have pissed it away at times in the lower middle order, trying to increase the scoring rate when it wasn't really necessary and struggling to properly build an innings. That's not going to be a problem for Hussey, but I can see it being a real issue for Watson in particular. If he comes in at 4 down and a couple of quick wickets go down, suddenly he's batting with the tail, where I think he'll struggle.

    People will talk about having your best batsmen up the order, like they have been with Pietersen, but Australia batted Border and Waugh at 5 and 6 through their entire careers with great success, when they were clearly among the top batsmen in the world. Ponting at 3 and Hussey a bit further down gives great balance.
    well yea, thats pretty much the idea here. But it all could go to waste if Watson isn't fit by next week.


  5. #95
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    IMO Flintoff isn't a good enough batsman to bat at 6, especially not in Australia. If Vaughan is walking he should be playing IMO. He is a batsman who the Australian's fear and he can pile on big runs and he could take a massive load of Flintoff's shoulders. Flintoff looked great for the first 4 days of the test match, but you could see how much he was hurt today, almost carrying the loss himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    Doesn't really matter IMO. I get the feeling Vaughan prefers to open and only dropped down for team balance so Strauss could open. If Vaughan is playing IMO it has to be at the top of the order and as captain. He needs to lead from the front..
    Solid points here dawg, Vaughan definately should play now, a big score in these little warm-up games will help his push for sure. Its up to Fletcher to come out of his comfort zone & pick him.

  6. #96
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    Yeah, you're right. Brett Lee has an amazing ability of avoiding the selection axe like no other player. Even when he was averaging 50 against England in 2001 he still managed to stay in the side for the 5th test. Even after averaging 31 against Bangladesh and 37 against Zimbabwe he still manages to hold his spot without question.
    ha, come on mayn. How can be so rough towards Bing, he's had a rough start to the series yea, but between the last Ashes up to the 1st test here even you can't deny how well he has bowled, then in this test the first time he has ever bowled consistent reverse swing. Cut the bloke some slack will ya...

  7. #97
    Hall of Fame Member FaaipDeOiad's Avatar
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    When it comes down to it, Vaughan is a good player but I'd be very happy with him in the side right now, as an Australian fan. He'd either replace a quality batsman who is just as likely to make runs, or he'd replace a bowler and put extra pressure on the likes of Harmison and Giles.

    The best team in Perth for England would be with Panesar in for Anderson and Mahmood on standby for Giles depending on the surface.

  8. #98
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    ^ Agree with that post 100%.

  9. #99
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  10. #100
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    If Fred can handle the workload (a family-sized if, admittedly, but desperate times/desperate measures & all that) I think I'm sold on the 4-bowler attack now. There seems little point in persisting with Giles, Anderson & even Harmison on the grounds that they're nominally bowlers.

    Personally I'm still a little uncertain about Read, but Jones played a desperately ordinary shot today, so I guess he can come in too. Jones's keeping has certainly been at least as good as Read's was v Pakistan tho.

    Strauss
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    Read+
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    Panesar

    Arguably strengthens the batting & the bowling! I imagine Saj, Monty, Joyce & Read will all get a go in the two-day thrash v WA so hope all do well.
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  11. #101
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    1) Strauss
    2) Cook
    3) Bell
    4) Collingwood
    5) Pietersen
    6) Flintoff
    7) Read
    8) Mahmood
    9) Hoggard
    10) Harmison
    11) Panesar

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  12. #102
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie
    ha, come on mayn. How can be so rough towards Bing, he's had a rough start to the series yea, but between the last Ashes up to the 1st test here even you can't deny how well he has bowled, then in this test the first time he has ever bowled consistent reverse swing. Cut the bloke some slack will ya...
    Why should I? The guy gets so much credit for doing nothing. Lee's bowling average before the first test against the West Indies was 33.04 and it is now 32.21, it isn't like he's burst back on to the scene and dropped his bowling average under 30, which he had a perfect opportunity to do with two test against Bangladesh where he averaged close to 100 with the ball - that's terrible and nobody can deny that.

    Since that W.I. test, this has been his figures:

    1/59, 5/30, 3/32, 2/99, 3/111, 4/46, 5/93, 1/83, 3/92, 0/23, 3/82, 1/48, 3/37, 2/47, 5/69, 1/65, 3/57, 3/57, 0/68, 1/47, 0/36, 1/35, 1/51, 1/98, 1/139 & 2/35.

    Sure he started that period well, but come on...he is a new ball bowler who bowls fast. He should at least be getting early top order wickets or a bag against the tail enders. Sure he's bowled better, I'll admit that, but he's hardly been knocking back stumps. Only 5 wickets in an innings 7 times and he was stuck on 4 from his 13th test until his 44th test.
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  13. #103
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Johnners's Avatar
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    Your forgetting the fact that only Macgill & Gillespie bowled effectively in Bangladesh, whats even more of a coincidence is that they were the 2 bowlers who hadn't been playing cricket all around the world non-stop since the 2005 Ashes series.

    Hayden could also come under the "avoiding the axe" category need i remind you. Yes he had more "credit" stored up than Lee, but he was decididly ordinary for the 15 months leading up to the 05 ashes, and will most likely avoid the selectors axe again if he fails this series.
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  14. #104
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    Exluding my personal thoughts I pretty sure Fletcher will go for the same team in Perth, perhaps with Mahmood/Plunkett in for Anderson being the only change. Though after his Hoggard/Anderson comments the same team could be on the cards.

    There is no way he'll drop Giles for Perth.

  15. #105
    Hall of Fame Member FaaipDeOiad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright

    Since that W.I. test, this has been his figures:

    1/59, 5/30, 3/32, 2/99, 3/111, 4/46, 5/93, 1/83, 3/92, 0/23, 3/82, 1/48, 3/37, 2/47, 5/69, 1/65, 3/57, 3/57, 0/68, 1/47, 0/36, 1/35, 1/51, 1/98, 1/139 & 2/35.
    That's 55 wickets @ 29.80. Before the last 8 innings there, it's 48 wickets @ about 23. Actually, excluding the end of that sequence, it's evidence of consistently good bowling, with multiple wickets in almost every innings and an overall good average. I don't really know how you could possibly use that part of Lee's career to argue that he's a poor test bowler. He bowled well ffs, and look lots of wickets at a good average against good opposition. What else is he meant to do?

    And as far as "bringing his average down into the 20s" is concerned, why is that relevant? The guy had over 150 wickets, so obviously it'll take a while for his average to come down. Flintoff still averages in the 30s too, does that mean his bowling in the last few years has been no good? The only thing that matters is how well he actually bowls in the matches in question. Certainly in the Ashes so far (aside from yesterday) he's been very disappointing, and before yesterday I was fairly comfortable with him being dropped from the team for a while if they wanted to include a second spinner. I really don't see what your point is about his bowling last year, though.

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