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Thread: Not getting the horn...

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by G.I.Joe View Post
    What does that even mean? The decibel scale isn't folklore. And there's a major difference between exposure to those levels for brief periods as in that competition, and 90 minutes as in the case of these horns. It makes no sense comparing the peak dB levels in one instance to the same levels maintained over 90 whole minutes as in the case of the vuvuzela. The average dB levels in the EPL were measured to be closer to 90 dB. An army of vuvuzelas stays at 120dB throughout the game no matter what.
    Vuvuzelas are spread over the stadium. When you watch it on TV you feel it is constant because of mics being all over the place. But in actuality the greatest exposure comes from the person standing next to you and unless he is the pied piper's successor I can't imagine anyone blowing the horn for more than 5 minutes at the most. It is not as if every fan is surrounded by an army of vuvuzela blowing spectators who take turns to ensure the drone is constantly kept over the 90 minutes is it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matteh View Post
    When somewhere between 30,000 and 90,000 are blowing horns, it creates a constant noise for 90 minutes though, which is the constant drone everyone hates.

    Shouting for a minute for the purposes of a competition just is nothing like the same issue AND shouting isn't a boring drone.
    Shouting is pervasive throughout the game is it not? How is it "just one roar and then silence"?

    Anyway good night thanks for the discussion.

  3. #78
    U19 Cricketer Corli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    Vuvuzelas are spread over the stadium. When you watch it on TV you feel it is constant because of mics being all over the place. But in actuality the greatest exposure comes from the person standing next to you and unless he is the pied piper's successor I can't imagine anyone blowing the horn for more than 5 minutes at the most. It is not as if every fan is surrounded by an army of vuvuzela blowing spectators who take turns to ensure the drone is constantly kept over the 90 minutes is it?
    For the most part, you have enough people blowing them close to you to be really, really annoying and quite possibly dangerous. Friends of mine who went to the France-Uruguay game said that they were warned to buy earplugs, as the noise is really loud in the stadiums. So I do think the vuvuzelas qualify as dangerous and I personally would prefer if they are banned, at least for games not involving South Africa.

  4. #79
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    I prefer this bee sound to booing and whistling the opposition in the EPL.It's okay to be quiet like in India But booing opposition is just disgrace to sports really
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    No I am offering another perspective on things. English footballing crowd is documented to be among the worst and I find it amusing when other cultures' enjoyment of the sport is being scoffed at.
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  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    20 years is too long a period. But I agree since 2000, thanks to stringent laws enacted and their stiff execution, English authorities have been able to rein in considerably the threat. Preventive arrests are the key here.
    How is 20 years too long a time period?

    Facts are, for anyone English who's of a similar age to me (25), major crowd trouble at the ground has been almost non-existant for their lifetime.

    English stadia are comfortable, safe environments to watch sport in.

  6. #81
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    I've only ever seen trouble inside a ground once, first hand. Rangers FTR

    Seen a couple of pubs ripped apart but given the amount of games I've been to and the fact I've been going twenty years, I can safely say Sir Alex has no clue what he's talking about, as per usual. Wears his anti-Englishness as a badge of honour, tragic.

  7. #82
    International Coach G.I.Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    Vuvuzelas are spread over the stadium. When you watch it on TV you feel it is constant because of mics being all over the place. But in actuality the greatest exposure comes from the person standing next to you and unless he is the pied piper's successor I can't imagine anyone blowing the horn for more than 5 minutes at the most. It is not as if every fan is surrounded by an army of vuvuzela blowing spectators who take turns to ensure the drone is constantly kept over the 90 minutes is it?
    Exposure to 120+ dB for more than 30 seconds is documented as a cause of hearing loss and pain.

    There were 84,000 vuvuzelas at the opening ceremony. Assuming that the stadium seats twice as many people, thats still 50% of the spectators wielding those horns. Calculate the number of vuvuzelas in an appropriate radius for an individual, bearing in mind that the reduction is only 6 dB for every doubling of distance, and throw in those 5 minutes per person, a conservative estimate at that, plus a variable for them taking turns.

    I don't need to be SS to figure out that's a lot of noise.
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  8. #83
    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Alex View Post
    Vuvuzelas are spread over the stadium. When you watch it on TV you feel it is constant because of mics being all over the place. But in actuality the greatest exposure comes from the person standing next to you and unless he is the pied piper's successor I can't imagine anyone blowing the horn for more than 5 minutes at the most. It is not as if every fan is surrounded by an army of vuvuzela blowing spectators who take turns to ensure the drone is constantly kept over the 90 minutes is it?
    Wow, how wrong you are. Admittedly the noise isnt as bad as big local PSL games but the noise is next to you all the time and almost trance inducing. Id recommend that you stop imagining. It is non-stop and not comparable to anything in the English game. I can assume you have never been to a SA soccer game to witness this

    Regarding what people have said about health and saftey. You have to remember where this WC is. You cant expect the same behaviour or standards. Also, as I said, the noise isnt as bad as compared to big local games. Someone mentioned stadium announcements. What stadium announcements? This is Africa and African football we are talking about with all accompanying good and bad.

    The 'horns' should come as no suprise to people. Its almost as if the TV companies and media have never watched a game from South Africa previously.

    Vuvus are going nowhere. They are a royal pain but once the decision was made to give the WC to SA then this could only be expected. They are not pleasant but people need to suck it up.
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  9. #84
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Furball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeraintIsMyHero View Post
    I've only ever seen trouble inside a ground once, first hand. Rangers FTR

    Seen a couple of pubs ripped apart but given the amount of games I've been to and the fact I've been going twenty years, I can safely say Sir Alex has no clue what he's talking about, as per usual. Wears his anti-Englishness as a badge of honour, tragic.
    Only time I can think we've played at Prenton Park was against Shelbourne in the UEFA Cup in 1998, we won 5-3. There was a bit of trouble beforehand but I don't remember any reports of trouble in the ground.

    Only ever seen crowd trouble twice - in 2002 vs Feyenoord when their fans decided to start attacking the Rangers fans on the other side of the police cordon, and in Bucharest last year, where I up at the back of the Rangers section, and suffered the appaling organisation of the Romanian police. While I'm not excusing what our fans did that night, I can fully understand why some fans reacted the way they did.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goughy View Post
    Wow, how wrong you are. Admittedly the noise isnt as bad as big local PSL games but the noise is next to you all the time and almost trance inducing. Id recommend that you stop imagining. It is non-stop and not comparable to anything in the English game. I can assume you have never been to a SA soccer game to witness this

    Regarding what people have said about health and saftey. You have to remember where this WC is. You cant expect the same behaviour or standards. Also, as I said, the noise isnt as bad as compared to big local games. Someone mentioned stadium announcements. What stadium announcements? This is Africa and African football we are talking about with all accompanying good and bad.

    The 'horns' should come as no suprise to people. Its almost as if the TV companies and media have never watched a game from South Africa previously.

    Vuvus are going nowhere. They are a royal pain but once the decision was made to give the WC to SA then this could only be expected. They are not pleasant but people need to suck it up.
    That's the exact opposite of how you work those things, Goughy.

  11. #86
    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G.I.Joe View Post
    That's the exact opposite of how you work those things, Goughy.
    Damn, Ive been out of South Africa too long. Lesson learnt.

  12. #87
    Anyone who doubts the vuvuzelas are a danger to health (hearing) really is on a different planet. There's simply not an argument there. It would be interesting if diagnosis was done properly on things like the incidence of tinnitus.

    For me they should be banned. The culture and all that is bull****. The poorer South Africans are already effectively excluded from going. The vuvuzelas have a whole multitude of negative effects and virtually no positive ones.
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  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaly piscine View Post
    Anyone who doubts the vuvuzelas are a danger to health (hearing) really is on a different planet.
    Its not that anyone doubts it. It is just that noone gives a ****. You want to go to South Africa and tell them that horn blowing can hurt peoples ears and they will laugh at you. They (possibly rightly) dont care and couldnt care less if you, and others, do. Its not a big deal locally.

    As they say out there "This is Africa, toughen up."

    I dont want to sound like I like them, as I dont, but I know why they are used and how they are valued locally.

  14. #89
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    The BBC has definitely jacked up the volume on Pearce & Mick The Plank's commentary for the Eyetie/Para game to try to drown them out. If being forced into such desperate measures isn't a clinching argument for banning them then I dunno what is.
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  15. #90
    Eternal Optimist / Cricket Web Staff Member GIMH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GingerFurball View Post
    Only time I can think we've played at Prenton Park was against Shelbourne in the UEFA Cup in 1998, we won 5-3. There was a bit of trouble beforehand but I don't remember any reports of trouble in the ground.

    Only ever seen crowd trouble twice - in 2002 vs Feyenoord when their fans decided to start attacking the Rangers fans on the other side of the police cordon, and in Bucharest last year, where I up at the back of the Rangers section, and suffered the appaling organisation of the Romanian police. While I'm not excusing what our fans did that night, I can fully understand why some fans reacted the way they did.
    Haha yeah that was the one. I was fibbing before, the trouble was before the game. Bottles flying outside the boozer. In the ground it was okay really, your lot were mouthing off at the stewards but let's be honest, we've all done that haven't we?

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