New Zealand- could they just win it?

[Naumaan]

Originally Posted by Howsie

Well lets compare it to England' shell we.

1.Key
2.Bopara
3.Pietersen
4.Shah
5.Collingwood.

If your calling NZ's top five horrible, whats the word to describe this bunch.

Australia's top five is also pretty bad:

Warner
Watson
Ponting
D.Hussey
Symonds

Warner's crap, he is good for maybe 15-20 till he gets out. I haven't seen Watson for ages so I have no idea. Ponting is rubbish, and Dave Hussey is yet to prove anything at the international level. Symonds should be good though.

****** yeah if not better, newzealand's top order is as good as of any other team, certainly far better than England's top order, but i hope both these teams do well, & 1 of them wins, in case my team doesn't manage to win lol*******

[Scaly piscine]

Originally Posted by rivera213

A statistical comparison of NZ to India and South Africa:

McCullum- 27.71 @ 125.43sr
Ryder- 22.53 @ 121.62sr
Guptill- 17 @ 104.08sr (3 games only)
Taylor- 20.19 @ 127.66sr
Oram- 24.42 @ 156.68sr
Styris- 19.43 @ 113.33sr

Top 6 (combined) run average of 131.28 at a strike rate of 124.8

----------------

Sehwag- 22.27 @ 144.80sr
Gambhir- 29.81 @ 126.64sr
Raina- 24.75 @ 126.92sr
Rohit- 17.83 @ 122.98sr
Yuvraj- 29.11 @ 164.77sr
Dhoni- 17.92 @ 103.86sr

141.69 @ 131.66sr

---------------

Smith- 30.33 @ 127.27sr
Gibbs- 17.5 @ 133.15sr
Kallis- 10.75 @ 102.38sr (only 4 matches)
De Villiers- 12.57 @ 107.31sr
Duminy- 27.9 @ 133.49sr
A.Morkel- 21.85 @ 139.9sr

120.9 @ 123.93sr


Take from it what you will and bare in mind South Africa have recently face Australia and a pissed-off Tait.

Definitely not a crap top 6 by any means. I wish we had 1 as good!

There have been few T20Is played so statistically you'll not get much out of it, you also have players who've improved markedly or didn't take it seriously initially. Kallis for instance is a lot better than he used to be in T20, he could probably average 25-30 at a SR of 115-120. Not barnstorming by any means but a big improvement. De Villiers is clearly better than those stats, as is Dhoni whilst Albie Morkel is a far better late over hitter than Oram.

[Athlai]

And Taylor and Guptill are far better than those stats suggest, McCullum has over 1000 international runs in the format so you can't really count him out.

[Uppercut]

Originally Posted by Athlai

bonked would yield a better triple word score.

[Howsie]

Originally Posted by Scaly piscine

There have been few T20Is played so statistically you'll not get much out of it, you also have players who've improved markedly or didn't take it seriously initially. Kallis for instance is a lot better than he used to be in T20, he could probably average 25-30 at a SR of 115-120. Not barnstorming by any means but a big improvement. De Villiers is clearly better than those stats, as is Dhoni whilst Albie Morkel is a far better late over hitter than Oram.

So your telling us that a whole lot of other players should or will have better stats, what about Taylor's and Guptill's. Even Ryder's will improve, and to say Morkel is a better late over hitter then Oram is laughable.

[KiWiNiNjA]

Originally Posted by Scaly piscine

There have been few T20Is played so statistically you'll not get much out of it, you also have players who've improved markedly or didn't take it seriously initially. Kallis for instance is a lot better than he used to be in T20, he could probably average 25-30 at a SR of 115-120. Not barnstorming by any means but a big improvement. De Villiers is clearly better than those stats, as is Dhoni whilst Albie Morkel is a far better late over hitter than Oram.

Interesting analysis.

I thought you were suppose to be smart, but obviously not as your argument has some serious (and obvious) holes.

[Flem274*]

Originally Posted by Scaly piscine

There have been few T20Is played so statistically you'll not get much out of it, you also have players who've improved markedly or didn't take it seriously initially. Kallis for instance is a lot better than he used to be in T20, he could probably average 25-30 at a SR of 115-120. Not barnstorming by any means but a big improvement. De Villiers is clearly better than those stats, as is Dhoni whilst Albie Morkel is a far better late over hitter than Oram.

AKA I'm a skanky xenophobe syndrome

[Uppercut]

Originally Posted by Howsie

So your telling us that a whole lot of other players should or will have better stats, what about Taylor's and Guptill's. Even Ryder's will improve, and to say Morkel is a better late over hitter then Oram is laughable.

Is it?

[Flem274*]

Originally Posted by Uppercut

Is it?

Well Oram is clearly the better batsman, and is probably just as equal to Morkel on the hitting stakes, though Morkel could win slightly I guess.

[Scaly piscine]

Originally Posted by Howsie

So your telling us that a whole lot of other players should or will have better stats, what about Taylor's and Guptill's. Even Ryder's will improve, and to say Morkel is a better late over hitter then Oram is laughable.

Sorry but where has Ryder shown he's any glimpses of being a good T20 player? Certainly didn't in the IPL. His stats will get worse if anything. Oram's stats will nosedive dramatically if he's anything like as bad as he was in the IPL. Taylor's will go up if he comes off, but his average will never be that high. McCullum will go down once he's up against good bowling when it matters, as is the case generally with NZ who punch above their weight in meaningless games then their lack of quality is shown in the meaningful games when the big boys show up.

[Uppercut]

Originally Posted by Flem274*

Well Oram is clearly the better batsman, and is probably just as equal to Morkel on the hitting stakes, though Morkel could win slightly I guess.

Clearly the better batsman my arse. Morkel averages 41 in FC cricket to Oram's 33. Just because he plays the hitter role for Safrica doesn't mean he can't bat well the orthodox way.

[Howsie]

Originally Posted by Uppercut

Clearly the better batsman my arse. Morkel averages 41 in FC cricket to Oram's 33. Just because he plays the hitter role for Safrica doesn't mean he can't bat well the orthodox way.

He may average 41 but the South African's don't believe he will ever be good enough to be a proper test all-rounder.

[Flem274*]

Originally Posted by Uppercut

Clearly the better batsman my arse. Morkel averages 41 in FC cricket to Oram's 33. Just because he plays the hitter role for Safrica doesn't mean he can't bat well the orthodox way.

Albie Morkel bats at 8 for SA doesn't he? Also Orams test average is better by far than his FC one. Albie hasn't played a lot of tests yet, so who knows where he'll end up but atm the odds are easliy stacked in favour of Oram.

If I had to pick one to bat for my life, I'd pick Oram over Albie.

[Howsie]

Originally Posted by Scaly piscine

Sorry but where has Ryder shown he's any glimpses of being a good T20 player? Certainly didn't in the IPL. His stats will get worse if anything. Oram's stats will nosedive dramatically if he's anything like as bad as he was in the IPL. Taylor's will go up if he comes off, but his average will never be that high. McCullum will go down once he's up against good bowling when it matters, as is the case generally with NZ who punch above their weight in meaningless games then their lack of quality is shown in the meaningful games when the big boys show up.

So how much worse will his test match stats get, will they be down to the mid 20's shortly will they. Ryder will only get better in 20/20 cricket, he is only 24. And in the last three 20/20 internationals McCullum has scored three 50's, guiding NZ home twice. Your jealously towards NZ cricketers is very apparent.

[Flem274*]

Originally Posted by Howsie

So how much worse will his test match stats get, will they be down to the mid 20's shortly will they. Ryder will only get better in 20/20 cricket, he is only 24. And in the last three 20/20 internationals McCullum has scored three 50's, guiding NZ home twice. Your jealously towards NZ cricketers is very apparent.

Woo, woo, woo. When arguing with Scaly, don't help him by talking tests when we're talking 20/20.