Someone explain this weird *** game to me

[silentstriker]

No, really, I have a question on the WC format.


I know that the top two teams from each group advance to the next round after playing the other three teams in their group once. However, I can't find any information on how the tournament is structured after that.

So if US makes it out, who do they play, how many do they play and how is it organized? I know 16 teams move on, so are there now four groups of four, and then the top two teams move on from each group, until there are eight left? What happens after that?


Wikipedia was of no help, any information is appreciated.

[Sanz]

Dont Worry, US wont make it to the next round.

[BoyBrumby]

If the US progesses (presumably as runners-up from Group E) they'll play the winners of Group F (Brazil).

Then (ha!) they'd play the winner of the 2nd Round game between the winners of Group H (almost definitely Spain) & the runners-up of Group G (probably France or South Korea).

[silentstriker]

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

If the US progesses (presumably as runners-up from Group E) they'll play the winners of Group F (Brazil).

Then (ha!) they'd play the winner of the 2nd Round game between the winners of Group H (almost definitely Spain) & the runners-up of Group G (probably France or South Korea).

So its single game elimination from round two until the final?

So 16 teams make it out, and everyone only plays one game each to go down to eight, then four, then two and the winner?

Interesting, I thought it would be more than one game in the second round.

[steds]

Originally Posted by silentstriker

So its single game elimination from round two until the final?

So 16 teams make it out, and everyone only plays one game each to go down to eight, then four, then two and the winner?

Yes. This might help in some small way.

[luckyeddie]

Originally Posted by silentstriker

So its single game elimination from round two until the final?

So 16 teams make it out, and everyone only plays one game each to go down to eight, then four, then two and the winner?

Interesting, I thought it would be more than one game in the second round.

They tried the horrendous 'second round groups' in the past, and it served two purposes.

a) Made the tournament a week longer - I think there were 24 teams in it at the time going down to 16 for the second round groups. We had the farcical situation of third-place teams going through to make the numbers up.
b) Bored everyone to tears because teams continued the 'cagey' approach.

[Samuel_Vimes]

Originally Posted by luckyeddie

They tried the horrendous 'second round groups' in the past, and it served two purposes.

a) Made the tournament a week longer - I think there were 24 teams in it at the time going down to 16 for the second round groups. We had the farcical situation of third-place teams going through to make the numbers up.
b) Bored everyone to tears because teams continued the 'cagey' approach.

Nah, the third-placed teams only went through when they scrapped the group stages (in 86) and went with four direct knock-outs. That lasted three cups, until they expanded again in 98.

There's also c) Huge potential for match-fixing (West Germany 1 - 0 Austria, Argentina 6 - 0 Peru)

Edit: Anyway, direct knock-out ought to be perfectly sensible to Americans - it's just version of yer sacred play-offs, without wild cards or any fancy stuff, and single-match encounters.

[BoyBrumby]

Originally Posted by luckyeddie

They tried the horrendous 'second round groups' in the past, and it served two purposes.

a) Made the tournament a week longer - I think there were 24 teams in it at the time going down to 16 for the second round groups. We had the farcical situation of third-place teams going through to make the numbers up.
b) Bored everyone to tears because teams continued the 'cagey' approach.

Not true actually; in 74 & 78 (16 team tournies) the second group stages replaced the quarters & semis with two 4 team groups & in 82 (24 team) 12 teams advanced to 4 groups of 3.

It was after that FIFA introduced the 2nd knock out stage with 16 out of 24 going thru (4 best performing 3rd placed teams + group winners & runners-up) which they stuck with til it was expanded to 32 teams in 98.

EDIT: Vimes renders post superfluous...

[luckyeddie]

Memory is a funny thing.

[silentstriker]

Ah ok. I wasn't indicting the current system or anything. I don't have any knowledge of the sport to make any sort of judgement (except that hit on McBride...that isn't cool in any sport outside of hockey).

I just couldn't find any information on the structure of the tournament, which people assume everyone knows (and probably most people outside the US do).

[GIMH]

Third placed teams going through was a bit of a joke, although in 94 you would have had 2 teams eliminated with 6 points had the top 2 only gone through! And teams with groups of three was a stoopid idea, with one team not getting to play in the last match. FIFA now, of course, demand simultaneous kick-off times for the final group games.

[Xuhaib]

Hey guys just looked at the draws and it seems Brazil and Argies cant meet before the final. No matter what this is probably the final that every neutral must be drooling for, though i wont be surprised if Spain upsets the world champs in the QF.

[luckyeddie]

Originally Posted by Xuhaib

Hey guys just looked at the draws and it seems Brazil and Argies cant meet before the final. No matter what this is probably the final that every neutral must be drooling for, though i wont be surprised if Spain upsets the world champs in the QF.

Really?

What happens if Holland beat Argentina to win the group?

Then, assuming that Brazil don't get thrashed in their final group match and end up finishing runner-up to Australia (like that's going to happen ) then Brazil would play Argentina in the semi-finals (assuming neither get beat in the quarters, of course) - I think.

[GIMH]

Yep, Eddie's right, if Holland top the group a Brazil-Arg semi is a possibility, but it won't happen, as England will meet Brazil in the semis.

[Xuhaib]

Originally Posted by luckyeddie

Really?

What happens if Holland beat Argentina to win the group?

Then, assuming that Brazil don't get thrashed in their final group match and end up finishing runner-up to Australia (like that's going to happen ) then Brazil would play Argentina in the semi-finals (assuming neither get beat in the quarters, of course) - I think.

I was taking the assumption that if everything goes according to plan, however we know in sport anything can happen thats why we love it so much.